Syria – What Next?

Written by – Susan Parsons….

 Before I go into this I must add an important disclaimer: this situation is changing by the minute!

I have almost recovered from Rosh Hashana and am on a bit of a ‘high’ regarding Mr Abbott’s election.

Parts of the past week were, of course, spent with family and friends and needless to say, unlike in the ‘olden days’, politics and religion were the main topics of conversation.

Being  one of the family’s ‘dark horses’  I tend to veer to the right side, but really consider myself a libertarian Zionist who is more interested in common sense than anything else.

One conversation I had with a relative concerning Syria stood out: should Syria be bombed as the Obama administration has been advocating strongly?

I am actually against bombing Syria.

Whilst I know it is not a friend of Israel, quite the contrary, there is no definitive proof that Bashar Al Assad gassed his own people. It could have been anyone. I am also not dismissing the possibility of a ‘false flag’ operation.

Many conflicts have started this way, for example the Burning of the Reichstag.

Burning of the Reichstag

 I  find any decision, or even an opinion, made by Barack Obama to be questionable especially on this issue as he seems to be backing the rebels.

If he said the weather was nice down in Melbourne I would have to go outside and check to make sure. I make no apologies for my attitude towards him. It is not based on race or religion – whatever his may be.

I base my opinion on “the content of his character”.

I am finding it difficult to understand why he is so keen to get involved in another war. This man won the Nobel Peace Prize remember?

And for what exactly? Probably for not being George W. Bush!

The particular conversation I mentioned above concerned the fact that as a civilised nation we cannot let leaders of countries  get away with using chemical weapons on principle.

In the case of Syria I urge caution.

The unintended consequences of such an attack would be catastrophic. It could end up a proxy war between the USA and Russia and China. Putin has intimated as much.

Would it become a Sunni/ Shi’ite proxy war? Iran versus Saudi Arabia?

Is it another ‘blood for oil’ scenario even though Syria doesn’t have vast reserves?

Does Obama want to get rid of Assad so he can install the Muslim Brotherhood in Syria? So many layers to all this.

Why would anyone wish to start this kind of war? Cui bono? The Saudis? Anyone else?

I find it rather hypocritical for the likes of Obama and especially John Kerry to condemn chemical weapons.

 Did not the USA use Agent Orange and Napalm in Vietnam?

Agent orange

Kerry was around then and he should know better.  The situation is quite different but isn’t the principle the same even though Kerry says it would be “unbelievable small”?

It still boils down to using chemical weapons in a war that would undoubtedly kill many more civilians. If the death of civilians, especially children, in Syria is such a tragedy – and it is –  why did the USA wait so long to intervene? And if they intervene now they will kill even more.

The end result is the same. Does this make sense? Not to me. Killing is killing.

I find it incredibly interesting that most Americans are against this war, from both sides of the aisle.

Harry Reid, Leader in the US Senate says it should be done because look at what Hitler did in his gas chambers?

This is the same comment as a relative made to me. Does Godwin’s Law apply here? I think it does.

Let’s not forget that Syria is fighting a civil war – not World War 2.

So now it seems Obama is backing down and it looks like Putin could have saved the day.

If this happens, great.

If this happens then Putin saves not only the USA but possibly World War 3.  

 Who would have ever thought this was possible?

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29 comments

  1. Susan Parsons

    Judge Jeannine Pirro says it a lot better than I do!

  2. Susan, I agree that intervening in Syria would be disastrous, partly because we don’t know which side used chemical weapons, but mostly because the other side in Syria – coyly called the ‘rebels’ (well, I guess it’s better than calling them freedom fighters!) – are assorted jihadis who are far more dangerous.

    The other night there was a snippet about the Christians in Syria and how the ‘rebels’ had been attacking their village and destroying their churches. They were unanimous that however awful the Assad regime was, at least it offered some measure of protection to the Christians there.

    As for Obama, I have to agree with you. It must by now be clear, even to the most ardent supporters, that he has reached out to the Muslim Brotherhood and invited them into his inner circle. We know that the MB come to the West “to sabotage our miserable house from within”, so the judgment of anyone who supports them must be suspect.

    • Sure it would be great if whoever was responsible for those dreadful chemical attacks could be punished for it. But we aren’t sure who did it and to be quite honest with you I think one side is as bad as the other.

      Even if it were punishable, how on earth can you go in weeks after the event, with warning of your planned attack? It’s utterly stupid.

      We know that already Assad has moved much of his weaponry out of harms way.

      “The 2,000-year-old Jobar Synagogue in the Syrian capital of Damascus was looted and burned to the ground.

      The Syrian army loyal to President Bashar Assad and rebel forces are blaming each other for the destruction of the historic synagogue, according to reports on Sunday.

      The synagogue is said to be built on the site where the prophet Elijah anointed his successor, Elisha, as a prophet. It had been damaged earlier this month by mortars reportedly fired by Syrian government forces.

      The rebels said the Syrian government looted the synagogue before burning it to the ground, Israel Radio reported Sunday.

      The government said the rebels burned the synagogue and that so-called Zionist agents stole its historic religious items in an operation that had been planned for several weeks, the Arabic Al-Manar Television reported, citing the Arabic Syria Truth website.

      Read more: http://forward.com/articles/174075/-year-old-jobar-syrian-synagogue-in-damascus-b/#ixzz2eUKprsAC

      Jobar synagogue

    • Pam,

      “It must by now be clear, even to the most ardent supporters, that he has reached out to the Muslim Brotherhood and invited them into his inner circle.”

      In my experience, most Obama supporters remain blind to the fact that his administration has supported the rise of political Islam throughout the Middle East.

      They won’t face it. They won’t admit it. And if you make the assertion they will question your rationality, if not your sanity.

      I am frankly astonished at the number of people for whom reality is determined by their political disposition and loyalties.

      • Michael, I guess I was indulging in a bit of wishful thinking about Obama supporters, who refuse to remove their rose coloured glasses when it comes to their Messiah.

        As you say, they won’t face the reality, probably because they have built their whole identity on Obama being the great saviour, and if they admitted they were wrong, they would be left with the empty shell of themselves. Far better to shoot the messenger and vilify those who dare to challenge them with facts.

      • Pam, it’s a very odd dynamic.

        I sometimes describe it as standing before a tree with a friend and saying, “Oh, look, there’s a tree” and the friend says, “Tree? Tree? What tree? Are you mad? Whatever are you talking about?”

        At this point it is unquestionably part of the historical record that the Obama administration supported the rise of political Islam throughout the Middle East, particularly in Egypt via support for the Muslim Brotherhood. Obama even pledged heavy weaponry, including F-16 fighter jets and Abrams tanks to the Morsi government and yet, still, my Jewish pro-Obama friends absolutely refuse to acknowledge that Obama supported political Islam.

        It’s simply unbelievable.

        They refuse to acknowledge that which is before their very noses and I do not come from the ideological right seeking to undermine the left.

        I come out of the left, itself!

  3. What a beautiful synagogue and how sad to think of the many synagogues and churches that have been destroyed throughtout the Arab world. It’s strange how little publicity is given in the Western media to this destruction of cultures.

    As for which side destroyed the synagogue, who knows. Neither side has any fondness for Jews or their buildings, so it could have been either.

  4. I don’t want Syria bombed for different reasons. Why these dumb f—s are killing each other they are not attempting to Kill Jews across the border. Also every Syrian male killed is one less Syrian soldier and why should Americans , Aussies or any other westerners risk their lives for what ? Let them keep going destroying their country , infrastructure and moral.

  5. It’s one of those situations where you’re damned if you do and damned if you don’t. Israel most definitely does NOT want to be involved in this internal Syrian matter. It’s a civil war and they are trying to drag us into it – and I don’t mean just Assad’s threats to target Israel with rockets if he’s attacked by the Americans, but also the way Obama has managed to make it look as if it’s the Israel lobby/the Jews who are pushing for war.

  6. Shimona, yes, as usual Israel is in a no win situation. Whatever happens in Syria, the world will blame Israel and the sinister ‘Jewish lobby’. Nothing every changes for anti-Semites.

    Obama has to find someone to blame for the difficult situation he is in, with Congress opposing his desire to get their approval for attacking Assad and so pleasing his Muslim Brotherhood buddies. Who better to scapegoat than the ‘Jewish lobby’.

  7. I heard al’Obama has asked Assad what day and time would be suitable for his United States
    to drop a few bombs on the [ now ] empty Chemical weapons warehouse in downtown Damascus, that would be the warehouse situated directly next door to the Kindergarten and maternity Hospital .

  8. Susan Parsons

    As I said, it’s changing by the minute. Obama has painted himself into a corner with his own stupid ‘red line’ which he now says is the world’s red line.

    He didn’t take a lot of notice of the red line Bibi drew at the UN re Iran! What a surprise!

    Danny Danon has said Israel does not want to be involved in this.

    As for the Holocaust comparison I think Brendan O’Neill has it about right!

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/brendanoneill2/100235260/the-people-milking-the-memory-of-the-holocaust-to-justify-an-airstrike-on-syria-are-moral-relativists-and-charlatans/

  9. Susan Parsons

    Another update:

    This article by Putin:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/opinion/putin-plea-for-caution-from-russia-on-syria.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&

    And Tony Abbott has pledged to help Obama *double face palm”!!

  10. Let’s look at it this way:

    Syria, once a “respectable” player in the region is now beyond the status of a basket case.
    Syria must be included in the group of local countries already, practically, under Western, mostly USA control – see Iraq and Afghanistan -.
    Internal war has revealed:
    – Assad will have to go and he may be given asylum in Russia.
    – opposition groups only with high levels of political acceptability will be integrated in a new form of national reconciliation.
    – infiltrated extremists or the local ones must be disposed of.
    ( I should arrange the order of necessary action a bit better )

    – chemical weapons will need to be identified and taken out of any possible use by any of the local fighting sides.
    – if , after chemical weapons secured/destroyed, Assad refuses to go, then surgical aerial attacks will happen so that Assad will get the message, leave and a new ( Serbian style ) political arrangement will take place. USA forces will be allowed/invited in to secure remaining opposition forces unacceptable/extremist, are disposed of. New national Syrian army, under new leadership, will assist.
    USA will be asked to remain in Syria as long as necessary,

    Israel will take care of Hezbollah which will be told that their stay/assistance is no longer required, but they will insist that they have a “right” to stay. Hence Israel’s necessary action.
    If Iran causes trouble , it will be reminded that on “that” table there are radical measures against it as well. If Iran persists, then Israel included there will be the long awaited surgical intervention against its own unwanted capabilities.
    Have you noticed that the word “Obama” is nowhere to be seen !!?? That’s because the ;poor sod has absolutely NOTHING to do at the personal level with the situation. He is merely the President of America and that does not make him the “owner” of it. Everything he says is worked out by the many people charged with ensuring that America goes a certain route.
    I suggest all those engaged in a Obama drama (!!) concentrate on political imperatives rather than “romanticized” looks at a protagonist of girly post Victorian richly ornamented irrelevant fiction.

    • Susan Parsons

      I have read so much about this Otto, and again it’s constantly changing.

      One thing is pretty clear: the US wants to go to war.

      It will be interesting if this proves all those ‘conspiracy theories’ I read about years ago, and hoped weren’t true.

  11. Susan,
    US MUST gain control of Syria. Syria is there for he taking under the present circumstances.
    The only difference might be that Russia could have a hand ( and feet/boots ) in the situation and on the ground. A radical change in the control of the region, but INEVITABLE.

    What do you mean by “conspiracy theories” ?
    ALL modes of power function on conspiracies !!! Conspiracies are organically the precursors of any action. Action, thereafter, is the only way life is maintained.

    • Susan Parsons

      Otto,
      as I said above I am against this war but I think it is going to happen.

      We don’t often see countries interfering in civil wars. Ireland? Sri Lanka? No oil? who knows?

      The US may fail to get control of Syria. Russia and the US are currently arming each side.

      The US is broke – Russia isn’t.

      Putin made the US look like amateurs.

      As for ‘conspiracy theories’: there are a lot!

      I used to think Agenda 21 was one of these but it isn’t. If you are familiar with it it helps explain a lot of what is happening right now and has been for sometime. It was signed in 1994 (or ’92) by Paul Keating. That is not to say it is just a left wing idea. George W.H. Bush signed the US up to it. It is a UN treaty.

      Then there is the theory that all countries will be split into 4 different allegiances controlled by:

      The Caliphate
      The UN
      Russia
      China

  12. Susan

    “Civil War” is often an inaccurate generic, a misnomer. It does not define the nature of the conflict. As such, the genesis of the conflict cannot be determined by the term. In general it refers to conflicts within the borders of one state. Considering, though, that many states were an amalgam of smaller fiefdoms, some with distinct ethnic and/or religious profiles, the conflicts would not be different from conflicts – wars – between clearly distinct states. We must also consider that, in the absence of a unitary confederation of similar ethnicity and even religion conflicts may arise without being classified as “civil”. Best example are the approx. 300 Germanic states often at war with each other, yet not considered “civil”.
    Digressing a bit, but, to Sri Lanka, for instance it was India’s ( Tamil Nadu state considered ) decision not to engage with Ceylon on account of its Tamils being at open war with the host Sri Lankans. One small reason, compared to decades long conflict India vs Pakistan, there were no territorial claims involved.
    Ireland is essentially of the religious kind and one cannot expect Vatican’s huge army to be involved. They are too busy posing for the tourists in their gorgeous costumes by top designer
    Mr. Buonarotti.

    As about the “quartet” you listed, UN cannot be seen as an Entante against other informal or otherwise “allegiances”.
    Specific economic expansions of the “group” kind are, however, more relevant. We must observe, though, that Russia has changed radically its former Soviet policies of aggrandizement. Russia is very happy, so far, with the enormous resources it exploits internally with criminal impunity that makes the masters in the Kremlin much more comfortable with their unchallenged exploits. Syria is an exception, predicated on the huge debts Syria has amassed with the Russian oligarchs.

    • Susan Parsons

      Otto,
      a very detailed and qualified definition of ‘civil war’.

      However most people would take the definition as the more common and colloquial meaning.

      Prefer your comparison to the Spanish Civil War. I may be a bit naive but it seems to me that perhaps more principles were involved although I do think that most, if not, all wars are fought for spoils.

      “As about the “quartet” you listed, UN cannot be seen as an Entante against other informal or otherwise “allegiances”.”

      The UN cannot be seen as any entente, or anything else other than a ‘holier than thou’ institution but we all know it isn’t one of these at all.

      I would be quite happy if it disappeared overnight but this isn’t going to happen!

      I believe it has ambitions/goals to be a global government body.

      Bob Brown, Gordon Brown, George Soros and Ahmadinejad have mentioned this is in the past.One man – one vote globally. Sounds awful to me!

  13. Yet, Syria can be considered as a civil war, although, it has attained proportions and various involvements that makes it a theatre of an international profile.
    Religion is essential. Conflicts between secular “socialist” dominated Govt. and religious interests of the kind that has attracted sects ranging from Suni, Shiia, Alawite, Christian, with ethnics from Druze to Assyrian, Armeninan, Turkmen, PKK ( Kurd ), Palestinian even Chechen, volunteers from UK, the rest of Arab countries and even Australia. It looks more like the Spanish Civil war ( yes civil and yet, not so civil with Nazi, Italo fascist and even regular Soviet , not to mention the famous International Brigades, in which some SIX members of my own family took part !! Each Brigade had a name and countries from which they came, including Palestine, of course only communist Jews ).
    Syria is the Spanish Civil War of the 21st Century !!!

  14. Susan
    we may say comfortably that all wars are fought for spoils, even when “principles” are claimed as “causa belli”. It may come as a surprise, but the Spanish Civil war had one such serious side, believe it or not, from the Soviet, pro Negrin Govt. side. Soviet Union, to simplify , Stalin, provided serious ,military backup for the Republican, leftist, Socialist Spanish democratically elected Govt. Yet, Stalin did it strictly contra cost and he demanded, and received, the payment exclusively in GOLD bullion. By the time the Spanish Central Bank gold reserves were gone – via the port of Odessa – the same Socialist Govt. was abandoned, all Russian troops, material returned to their barracks by the Volga. Franco, with his four plus one columns ( hence the expression ” the fifth column” ) marched into Madrid within weeks.

    About various cabalas conspiratorial theories, we may well add the famous …”Jewish” Francmasonic World Government which, according to popular legend, has been running the world at least since Louis Bonaparte – obviously a crypto-Jew , same as Bismark and Tsar Nicholas II, to name but a few……………..

  15. Interesting article

    SYRIA challenges the notion that intelligent life blooms in each corner of the Earth. Trapped in a fortress of traditions dictated by the Koran, Syrians, both rebels and government soldiers alike, are torturing each other, murdering one another, even filming children taking part in beheadings.

    As is so often the case when Islamists go to war with each other, savages emerge among men who, only 18 months back, might have been neighbours and would have told you they loved their children.

    For reasons best left to Muslims, the Koran can bring out the beast in many of its adherents.

    Allahu akbar! is the chorus as these Muslims slash at enemy throats, execute opponents in orderly lines and, according to the “international community”, use gas as a weapon.

    Read on:

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/opinion/not-much-to-choose-from-in-opposing-sides-in-syria-civil-war/story-fni0ffut-1226719578945

    • Another brilliant article from Alan Howe
      What a dream team of journalists at murdoch,s biggest selling newspaper in Australia. Bolt & Howe !

    • susan s. parsons

      It’s a really good article, Shirlee.

      I still hope the West butts out though.Probably not going to happen.

      • I had an argument on ‘South Australians supporting Israel’ with one of those know-it-all types about staying out. He’s carrying on about Obama being a coward.

        Let them get on with it, both sides are as bad as one another.